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Halo 3 (31st) and ODST (14th) Mythic Conqueror (Solo, Legendary, All skulls on). Holder of 7 current world wide speedrun records.
The Internet: Lightspeed Communication of Stupid Thoughts
Ignorance is the true enemy of all things.
Rocking Bungie.net for 5 years!
*continued from above*
We were able to kill several players without reloading in previous games, This isn't those games. Saying the game is different is not a valid reason.
[...] competitive Halo 1, 2, or 3, you would know that teamwork was just as powerful
At high levels of play, the differences in pure execution becomes negligable, investment is higher, and they begin seeking every advantage over the other team they can find. Like teamwork.
Look at matchmaking. No real teamwork appearing before level 35 or more (H3). Most players just wandered around lone wolf like.
If the innate design of the weaponry promotes a more team oriented approach, that brings teamwork down to lower levels of execution play. Which can only promote even better teamwork at even higher levels of execution play. Thats a good thing!
Let me give you an example: Spartan vs Elites. One on one, Elites outclass Spartans, faster, trickier... you know. After enough 1v1 beatings, the Spartans start bringing along a pal. The Elites start to lose more, maybe going 1 for 1 or worse. They start going in pairs, start winning again. The Spartans start keeping their entire team within engagement range, the Elites respond.
Result? Teamwork has been created within those who had none. Within a single match.
The effect is less pronounced in Spartan vs Spartan, but its still there.
[...] you cannot deny that there are several gameplay aspects that are severely hampered by the smaller magazines.
Yeah... Haven't seen a convincing argument yet. All you've said is that the individual doesn't seem as powerful, I can't pwn as much as I think is should be able to etc etc.
I feel way more useful spawning with a pistol than just the AR like in Halo 3. But its not a weapon you'll almost never swap out either.
Posted by: Bourbon OWNS
Obviously you kids didn't read the thread or you'd have come up with something better by now.Explain to me how calling everyone else 'kids' is different from other people calling you a 'noob'? You're doing the very thing you were denouncing in the same post.
Posted by: Bourbon OWNS
Are you even old enough to remember CE, or were you in diapers then? Oh, again... *facepalm* Now you're just a jerk.
[..] power weapons. You pick them up to gain a tactical advantage, not because they are the only way to win.
Anecdote: the other night I went 28 kills, 10 assist and 4 deaths in Invasion Slayer using mostly a pistol and DMR. Only 3 of my kills were non-weapon. The first frenzy using the pistol for 9 of the finishing blows. Power weapons are not the only way to win.
That is why BR starts were better. Better than an SMG, but once you had it there was little point to ever dropping it then. In the 'Halo ideal' they're too good as a starting weapon.
If they started you out with something usable the game would be far better. Thats why they have the pistol now. Scoped, headshot... I've already gone over this. You're just ignoring me.
[...] I'm saying it's still not quite enough, if you were able to kill 2 opponents per magazine it would be fantastic.If it was 10 rounds you'd have to be obscenely good to get 2 kills out if it. So you make it 12 rounds... wait, thats what the DMR is. Again, knock on effect on the entire sandbox. The pistol is set intentionally at 8 rounds. You fire way above the ideal rate of fire, have non-perfect aim, and hence miss more than 1 shot, and you can't get a body kill in the clip. You either have to finish with a headshot or reload. Thats your trade off.
Or use that weapon in your pocket...
Posted by: ThreeShot
Not one. Numbers don't lie. It's not an assumption but it's a fact.The people interpreting them can.
Posted by: gemrock555
[..] but if you are not good, that means you probably do not fully understand the game and it's mechanics. therefore you should not be talking about game balance.*bzzt* Wrong. Theres a lot on the execution side that requires a mix of both practice/familiarity, innate dexterity, and quick thinking. How many game developers do you know that are pro or exceptionally good at their own game? How many film critics, art critics, are good at making films/art themselves? Bungie are the engineers of the car we drive. Just because some are better at driving it that others, doesn't mean they know more about how to build a better one.
Thats a bad, elitist argument that has no basis in fact.
Posted by: Bourbon OWNS
[..]but if Bungie was really interested in discouraging spam, they would have given the Pistol 6 rounds, the AR 24, and the DMR 10. The current magazine sizes are completely arbitrary, copy and pastedYah...
5 shots kill with a headshot,
7 with body shots.
8 bullets in mag
And actually, 8 body shots exactly for Elites.
Fact is, in some situations, (eg. an opponent running away from you or is high above you, where you can't really hit their head quick enough) going for the body shot kill is a legitmate approach. Having to reload before that would be ridiculous and anti... nearly everyone. The way they are now, you have a little wiggle room for misses (or extra shots on another target). Maybe they didn't change them (for AR and pistol) from H3 because they didn't need to? Because those weren't the problems with said weapons? And where exactly was the 12 from DMR copied from? That weapon didn't even exist in Halo 3.
Combat Evolved. Remember when you first started out? It took you like an entire clip to kill damn near anything. But, as you got better at the game, your accuracy improved. [...]Ever considered this process simply hasn't happened yet for you in Reach? It took me a couple hundred games to start to get comfortable with the pistol, and now, after 400, I quite like it, but I'm no where near perfect with it. I keep misjudging ROF allowances and often my aim is simply bad anyway!
When Reach came out, the first thing I noticed is how bad the weapons sucked.First thing I noticed was how different it was to Halo 3. Makes one miss a lot to start with. Melee and spray weapons seem great to start with since its easy in CQC. Over time, the Pistol became my number 1 TOD.
For 9 years, guns have been an important part of Halo, and now all of a sudden they aren't? They still are. 4 of your top 5 TOD in standard are weapons. Number 5 being melee. You are the disproof of your own statement!
[..] posts in this forum, just endless people complaining [..] but did you even think that maybe Bungie went too far this time? Changes are always going to alienate somebody. When people are mad they shout it louder and longer than the people singing praises. Maybe they did change it so much that some people don't like it any more. But, whatever.
Oh, check this out [...] Enjoy. Also if you pay attention to the "full bloom" kills, kinda ruins your "spam" argument.This is... mostly useless.
As I said before, its not as simple as "fire it as fast as possible" vs "wait till it completely resets" You can be 'spamming' it at range even if you're not firing as fast as possible.
WHY? Because you're firing too fast for the range! Larger mags, in this context does increase spam, since you have more bullets to 'luck out' on in your mag and get a hit on the target. See the discussion right at the top of this post.
What it does give us is the absolute minimum kill time at point blank, and at greater range, the kill time we should be aiming to meet or beat as we attempt to push that boundary between ROF and accuracy trade-off.
Posted by: M0 Murder0
If they gave us the options to change individual weapon damage and magazine sizes for custom games,[...]
Just gonna note. I am 100% for being able to customise the game in nearly any which way you want, in custom games. Though, I dread the thought of the thousands of wannabe game designers going "perfected halo custom game setup!"
Posted by: Malachite
Go and ask any service member if they'd rather pack an AR or a Pistol as their primary and see what you learn.You're using realism as your argument? In a game with shields, and jetpacks, and aliens? Here, have some realism.
Posted by: ThreeShot
Halo CE had a good balance with the guns, and Halo 2 (BR starts) did as well,WTF?
Halo CE was Pistol all day long. Halo 2 was BR all day long (once they tweaked it about 5 times). Half the weapons were useless on their own and noob combo.... I just.... no.
There lies the problem. You assume it's an equilateral triangle where all sides are equal.
The -blam!-? You're assuming he's assuming its an equilateral triangle. He said 'use all of them' not 'use all of them equally.' Which you don't.
Posted by: ThreeShot
Hmm, I had a 2.0 k/d ratio, 3x as many kills with the DMR, Pistol, NR, and AR as I did deaths,Had being the operative word. Don't post that other stuff about your stats when we can just go and check.
Wanna know what my pistol kills to deaths is? Nearly 4 to 1. Yeah. Its awful.